Moses-support Digest, Vol 138, Issue 6

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Today's Topics:

1. Re: Dual Licensing or relicensing Moses (liling tan)
2. Re: Dual Licensing or relicensing Moses (Matt Post)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2018 00:19:24 +0800
From: liling tan <alvations@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Moses-support] Dual Licensing or relicensing Moses
To: Hieu Hoang <hieuhoang@gmail.com>
Cc: moses-support <moses-support@mit.edu>
Message-ID:
<CAKzPaJLDZxW+MgTvWKJt69J8Y18Y6w2EQ9VKAuEO72rBZMKp1g@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Got it.

So I think we'll just remove the MosesTokenizer and MosesDetokenizer
function from NLTK and maybe create a PR to put it in
mosesdecoder/scripts/tokenizer

Thank you for the clarification!
Liling

On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 12:17 AM, Hieu Hoang <hieuhoang@gmail.com> wrote:

> Still the same problem - everyone owns Moses so you need everyone's
> permission, not just mine. So no
>
> Hieu Hoang
> http://moses-smt.org/
>
>
> On 10 April 2018 at 17:13, liling tan <alvations@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I understand.
>>
>> Could we have permission that it's okay to derive work from Moses with
>> respect to the (de-)tokenizer and possibly other scripts under an
>> MIT/Apache tool?
>>
>> Legally it's a restriction but I think for what's it worth, having mutual
>> agreement between the OSS is sufficient to still keep any port of LGPL work
>> until someone starts to enforce legal actions and I think it's safe to back
>> off to taking down these functionalities in the Apache/MIT code.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Liling
>>
>> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 12:09 AM, Hieu Hoang <hieuhoang@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> we can't change the license, or dual license it, without the agreement
>>> of everyone who's contributed to Moses. Too much work
>>>
>>> Hieu Hoang
>>> http://moses-smt.org/
>>>
>>>
>>> On 10 April 2018 at 15:47, liling tan <alvations@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dear Moses Dev,
>>>>
>>>> NLTK has a Python port of the word tokenizer in Moses. The tokenizer
>>>> works well in Python and create a good synergy to bridge Python users to
>>>> the code that Moses developers have spent years to hone.
>>>>
>>>> But it seemed to have hit a wall with some licensing issues.
>>>> https://github.com/nltk/nltk/issues/2000
>>>>
>>>> General port of LGPL code is considered derivative and is incompatible
>>>> with Apache or MIT license. I understand that LGPL keeps derivative from
>>>> being proprietary but it's a little less permissive than non-copyleft
>>>> license like Apache and MIT licenses.
>>>>
>>>> Note that this licensing issue might also affect Marian which is MIT
>>>> license and also incompatible with LGPL so although technically users can
>>>> chain the code from different libraries, but Marian couldn't have any
>>>> dependencies on the Moses components. (But we know do know that none of our
>>>> models built with Marian would work without the Moses tokenizer which is in
>>>> LGPL).
>>>>
>>>> Would there be a possibility to dual license the Moses repository with
>>>> LGPL and Apache/BSD/MIT license. I'm not sure whether it's allowed to have
>>>> dual licenses with LGPL and Apache/BSD/MIT license though. Might have to
>>>> check with some proper legal personnel though.
>>>>
>>>> If dual license is not possible would it be possible relicense the code
>>>> under BSD/Apache/MIT license? That way it's more permissive for derivatiive
>>>> work?
>>>>
>>>> I think the last scenario is for NLTK to drop the Python port of Moses
>>>> code entirely from Apache license repository but I think that'll remove the
>>>> synergy between various OSS.
>>>>
>>>> Hope to hear from Moses devs soon!
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Liling
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Moses-support mailing list
>>>> Moses-support@mit.edu
>>>> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/moses-support
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
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Message: 2
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2018 18:39:56 +0200
From: Matt Post <post@cs.jhu.edu>
Subject: Re: [Moses-support] Dual Licensing or relicensing Moses
To: liling tan <alvations@gmail.com>
Cc: moses-support <moses-support@mit.edu>
Message-ID: <5A3DC380-0143-4D1C-B14C-DDC2F627B1C3@cs.jhu.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Liling?Would it work to get the permission of just those people who are in the commit log of the specific scripts you want to port?

matt (from my phone)

> Le 10 avr. 2018 ? 18:19, liling tan <alvations@gmail.com> a ?crit :
>
> Got it.
>
> So I think we'll just remove the MosesTokenizer and MosesDetokenizer function from NLTK and maybe create a PR to put it in mosesdecoder/scripts/tokenizer
>
> Thank you for the clarification!
> Liling
>
>> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 12:17 AM, Hieu Hoang <hieuhoang@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Still the same problem - everyone owns Moses so you need everyone's permission, not just mine. So no
>>
>> Hieu Hoang
>> http://moses-smt.org/
>>
>>
>>> On 10 April 2018 at 17:13, liling tan <alvations@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> I understand.
>>>
>>> Could we have permission that it's okay to derive work from Moses with respect to the (de-)tokenizer and possibly other scripts under an MIT/Apache tool?
>>>
>>> Legally it's a restriction but I think for what's it worth, having mutual agreement between the OSS is sufficient to still keep any port of LGPL work until someone starts to enforce legal actions and I think it's safe to back off to taking down these functionalities in the Apache/MIT code.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Liling
>>>
>>>> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 12:09 AM, Hieu Hoang <hieuhoang@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> we can't change the license, or dual license it, without the agreement of everyone who's contributed to Moses. Too much work
>>>>
>>>> Hieu Hoang
>>>> http://moses-smt.org/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On 10 April 2018 at 15:47, liling tan <alvations@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Dear Moses Dev,
>>>>>
>>>>> NLTK has a Python port of the word tokenizer in Moses. The tokenizer works well in Python and create a good synergy to bridge Python users to the code that Moses developers have spent years to hone.
>>>>>
>>>>> But it seemed to have hit a wall with some licensing issues. https://github.com/nltk/nltk/issues/2000
>>>>>
>>>>> General port of LGPL code is considered derivative and is incompatible with Apache or MIT license. I understand that LGPL keeps derivative from being proprietary but it's a little less permissive than non-copyleft license like Apache and MIT licenses.
>>>>>
>>>>> Note that this licensing issue might also affect Marian which is MIT license and also incompatible with LGPL so although technically users can chain the code from different libraries, but Marian couldn't have any dependencies on the Moses components. (But we know do know that none of our models built with Marian would work without the Moses tokenizer which is in LGPL).
>>>>>
>>>>> Would there be a possibility to dual license the Moses repository with LGPL and Apache/BSD/MIT license. I'm not sure whether it's allowed to have dual licenses with LGPL and Apache/BSD/MIT license though. Might have to check with some proper legal personnel though.
>>>>>
>>>>> If dual license is not possible would it be possible relicense the code under BSD/Apache/MIT license? That way it's more permissive for derivatiive work?
>>>>>
>>>>> I think the last scenario is for NLTK to drop the Python port of Moses code entirely from Apache license repository but I think that'll remove the synergy between various OSS.
>>>>>
>>>>> Hope to hear from Moses devs soon!
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Liling
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Moses-support mailing list
>>>>> Moses-support@mit.edu
>>>>> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/moses-support
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moses-support mailing list
> Moses-support@mit.edu
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/moses-support
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